Talk:Summoning/Archive 3

Re wrriten
wow i remember the first day this page was set up. the only thing thats been updated is that call to arms scroll. Update the dang page already Rabbadxs 12:21, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

Minimum Charms Method
I reverted the edit on the Minimum Charms section, as the rationale for its deletion.... that you can't possibly collect 15,000 blue charms is not really a sound reason for simply removing this section.

There certainly are multiple methods of trying to get to this goal, and of course trying to get to level 99 is a long and difficult process for nearly any skill. Keep in mind this is the "minimum" number of charms at each level.

Rather than simply deleting this page, perhaps it ought to be divided between each of the types of charms (on a separate page, perhaps?) which goes into detail about what the path to minimum charms are for that type of charm. It does change as you move up through the levels, as some creatures are certainly much better for you in terms of experience than others.... although there are several kinds of factors you can weight when trying to decide what creature you want to create a pouch for.

Some hard work has gone into this table, and without a compelling reason to delete it I would rather not be losing this information because somebody thinks "it is impossible" to find so many charms. I'd argue that it is possible, and in fact somewhat easier for players with high combat stats. We're talking level 99 here, not just trying to get to level 30. Is it tedious and time consuming? Yeah. Is it something that a player is going to "power level" to get? I don't think so, but in the long run it doesn't matter. This table simply spells out what the "minimum number of charms" would be required in order to get to level 99.

Removing this table also removes information that was added with hard work to the article, and doesn't help with providing an alternate method of crafting pouches. --Robert Horning 02:46, 20 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I believe that the new top xp pouch is the talon beast which is one of the new familiars from the summoning skill update. This should be directly applicable to the minimum charms method. 03:56, 20 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I added the Spirit mosquito pouch into the table, but I haven't looked at the other familiars which certainly should be re-examined. That is why I'm suggesting perhaps re-vamping the table somewhat to show the best xp for each type of charm, as it seems lop-sided to suggest only training with blue charms when you are going to be having plenty of other kinds of charms as well.  --Robert Horning 05:22, 20 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Correct me if I'm wrong but shouldn't the minimum charm method also add the experience gained from pouch to scroll conversions? Obviously that extra experience comes from charms that have already been transformed and would thus further reduce the total charms needed. 15:59, 23 June 2008 (UTC)


 * This is a fair enough suggestion. As a practical matter I tend to keep my pouches without turning them into scrolls except when I know of a useful scroll, but you do get more experience from making the scrolls.  If/when I get around to updating this table, I'll certainly keep this in mind.  --Robert Horning 10:48, 24 June 2008 (UTC)


 * The minimum charms method is cheaper than the minimum cost method...

Tertiary Notes?
Can you use noted items for the tertiary ingredient? 04:04, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * No, I'm afraid not.  5:41, 24 June 2008 (UTC)


 * There are some "stackable" tertiary ingredients, however, like a Proboscis that can permit certain forms of "power leveling". Such tertiary ingredients are usually quite expensive, however.  --Robert Horning 09:29, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Semi-stackable tertiary ingredients also include bananas (in baskets)and granite (can be brought in in large chunks then cut down on the spot). Don't know if this sort of goes to the same thing: Compost, while not stackable, can be stored at the leprachaun at the tree spot near the altar and retrieved, so they are very close by. 198.175.199.14 07:09, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

Summoning Monster
Image:Secret.PNG|thumb

When Summoning was first released, the opening screen to the game could be manipulated in Photoshop or some other graphical package to reveal another "monster" that was "hidden" within the visual screen.

For some reason, this image (even a thumbnail) was removed from this article. I don't think its removal is valid unless there is at least some sort of discussion and consensus about its removal. This image certainly was on the front page (I saw it!) and documented on multiple fan websites.

As to if it was intentional on the part of Jagex, I can't say. But it did happen, and it happened in conjunction with the release of Summoning. I feel it does belong in this article and the graphical element is fitting with other trivia text that discusses the image. --Robert Horning 15:15, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I believe that its a simple case of seeing what you want to see. Its pretty clear to me that its just some digital noise caused by uploading the graphic or intentionally put in to give the color a more natural appearance. But at the height of the summoning speculation craze someone decided to have some fun with photoshop (probably with the magic wand) and produced this. Since the image is mirror image it stands to reason that Jagex made one side then copied and pasted on the other. Since the image is perfectly symmetrical its extremely easy to see organic shapes in it. If you cover up one side of the image, you can see that the "design" really is just random noise. Also, without seeing the process of how its made, then it doesn't really matter WHAT you can see, since it can't be reproduced. For all we know, those black pixels are literally drawn in. I think the image should be removed as it contributes nothing significant to the article. --Psycho Robot 17:37, 30 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Image deleted. cflm (talk) 09:25, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Interesting...wery interesting, ...Tovarisch! --Balton 18:34, February 25, 2010 (UTC)

Automated transfer of Problem Report #11803
The following message was left by Anonymous via PR #11803 on 2008-07-13 00:57:34 UTC

''The article states that to trade in pouches, you must be 5 levels higher than the pouch you're trying to trade in. On the KB, it's relatively easy to find the page that explains the sliding scale system involved with trading in pouches. This is far different than just 5 levels above.''

Comparison to Prayer is inaccurate
The second paragraph says "The summoning skill shares similarities to Prayer, the skill is trained mostly through one action (infusing pouches)".

That's just not true. Prayer has many different ways it can be trained - just off the top of my head: Art stone 21:46, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * burying bones (assumption that is the one the author is thinking of)
 * burning pyre logs
 * killing ghasts
 * applying Pest Control points to prayer
 * burning Vyrewatch remains
 * making an offering to the ectofuntus
 * offering bones to the gods on a player owned altar
 * Yes... I see what you mean. But, its just a general statment, comparing the skills. A heck of a lot of bones are buried - I'd say a good 2/3 of all consumed, maybe more. You've got those burying bones they find, those burying bones to save inventory space (eg at metal dragons), and all free-to-players, whose single way of training prayer is to bury bones. The fastest way to train prayer is to use expensive bones - which a lot of players do not want to bury, due to the massive losses incurred. In regard to the other methods, they are practically not used - PC points are more often spent on other skills, Pyres and Vyrewatch as far as I can find give no prayer experience, ghasts are rarely fought, and the ecto and altar are used, but mainly by richer members. So most bones are buried.


 * But, as I said, its a passing reference. If you're unhappy with it, change it. Personnally, I think its fine as-is. 22:03, 5 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I vote for removing it. Its pretty unnecessary information IMO.
 * Oh and if "The summoning skill shares similarities to Prayer, the skill is trained mostly through one action (infusing pouches)" This is the case, Construction has no difference. It can be only trained by making furniture. Sernions 13:36, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Slayerbelle
Slayerbelle and Villandra are the same person. Villandra made the Slayerbelle to get an untrimmed Slayer cape, and (apparently) made Lorica to get the untrimmed Summoning cape. --nekobawt 20:52, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Lag template
I propose to replace the "If you have lag reading this..." section with this template at the top of the page. What do you think? 11:12, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Looks neater in the template format you made, go for it. See, this is why you got nommed for sysop :).--Degenret01 13:31, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Support. Looks nice, but I've reduced the width to 70%. It was too wide for my 1440x900 browser.  I also simplified the sentence a little.   14:22, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

5 Levels or more needed to swap for shards?
The article says "This will help the player save money on how many spirit shards one needs to buy, however, it would require the player to be at least 5 levels above the level required to make the pouch, and hence will never be possible for very high level pouches." Not true. In my experience only one more level than the required level to make the pouch is needed to swap the pouches into shards. I'll edit this part of article. User:Sernions 13:29, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, you need a minimum of level 21 to start exchanging pouches. After that, its scaled to the levels - pouches requiring 91-98 to make require one more level to exchange, and the steel titan pouch requires no more levels. Tis in the Game Guide . I would integrate the table myself, but I'm absolutly shattered tonight, so if its not done when I come on next I'll put it in somewhere. 23:07, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

TzHaar Fight Caves and Summoning
Figured this would belong here. Anyway, I've been curious and asking players about whether or not Summoning was allowed in the TzHaar Fight Caves. I've gotten mixed answers, so could someone help me out here (and, in the event that its not allowed, put it on the list on the article) --Pikaandpi 17:49, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

its not the guard stops you from bringing them in Aaroncampf 05:36, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Cap vs Cape
The skill cap is the upper limit of what your level can be. Therefore, the article should read, "Players can talk to their familiars if they have at least 10 or more summoning levels above the required level to summon that familiar, with some exceptions (i.e. minotaurs). Because of the skill cap of 99 and various other reasons, some familiars cannot be talked to." 00:04, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

Forbidden areas for familiars
I've added a paragraph on which transport methods do not allow familiars. I know that River Lum canoes and the balloon transport system block familiars.

I believe several other methods also do, but I haven't checked them recently. If anyone wishes, please check the following and add any that block familiars to the list: eagle transport system, gnome gliders, gnomecopters, magic carpets , dwarven mine carts, ogre boat rides, Shilo carts. Inelcirc 17:38, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Of those, I know they cannot on carpets, but can on gliders. Added to article. 15:56, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

"Previously familiars could not be summoned in Falador, although there was a glitch allowing them to be brought in." should this be added to Trivia? --Hairy apes 03:46, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

slayer helm
the slayer helm needs 20 summoning to allow scrolls to be put in it. can someone add that because i don't know how to. 68.231.165.161 15:55, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

Scrolls
I added the information that 1 pouch makes 10 scrolls related to that familiar. Bassjason1 23:36, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Lowest possible level for 99 summoning.
The guide originally stated that it is impossible to get 99 summoning at the lowest possible (which is level 15) but at level 21. This is incorrect, as players could merely play the minigame Soul Wars for an extreme amount of time spending the points on charms. The guide had previously said that the only ways were through random events (which honestly can't be taken seriously as the amount of genie lamps/knowledge books necessary would be at least every non-combat skill to 99) or through stealing from Dorgesh-Kaan. This second method would give the ranged experience to level the player up to level 21 combat with 99 summoning. I fixed it though, and if anyone has any comments, please notify me. Swordfishguy 21:33, 27 February 2009 (UTC)


 * The soul wars' talk page somewhere states that they could not buy any charms at level 3-6+. 09:46, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

Or you get some high level mates who kill cockroaches with you with lootshare on. Gives about 30 charms an hour without any requirements at all, so even being faster then sw.

Huh?
Someone deleted a lot of info, so I undid it, but the information is still missing? How come I only undid one sentence? Now it all that text needs to be put in again...  Oli4burggraa  Talk 19:21, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Moved information to new pages
i just moved some information to other pages so it would not take up so much space on this page and we could add even more to it now that it has its own page.

please dont undo it the lag was terrible and it slows the system down. we if they want the info they can get it much better on the new specialized pages.

Moved information to new pages
i just moved some information to other pages so it would not take up so much space on this page and we could add even more to it now that it has its own page.

please dont undo it the lag was terrible and it slows the system down. we if they want the info they can get it much better on the new specialized pages.

Need Temporary Stat Boost Methods
If this is the main Summoning page (there are so many with similar names, which itself is a problem), then it needs an indexed section telling the reader how to temporarily boost their summoning level. I can't find it here or anywhere else, for that matter. (Eviltexan 18:45, December 9, 2009 (UTC))
 * Thats because you can't. The only real way is with the skillcape. Mine was boosted to 62/57 after WGS, but that was a glitch. 18:48, December 9, 2009 (UTC)
 * I heard rumours about a +10 boost which can be had at the Battlefield (Clan Citadels), by using a skill powerup. You may not be able to summon higher leveled familiars outside the battlefield, but maybe you can use it to investigate Ancient effigies? Can anyone confirm this?? 11:09, November 7, 2011 (UTC)

Navigation Problems
The main Summoning page should provide navigation to the other supporting pages somewhere near the top. The only thing I see now is a link to Summoning Training. Exercise: ask a new user to find how much xp they'd get for making an ibis pouch, or how to maximize the xp they'd gain for a blue charm given their level and you'd be shocked at how difficult it is. (Eviltexan 20:04, December 9, 2009 (UTC))

Varrock West Bank
Does anybody have issues taking a familure into the basement in Varrock West bank? Mine just dissappears without warning. It's done this for about two years now. I've submitted bug reports multiple times, but it has never been fixed. Could this be intentional? Anybody else have this issue? --Condor85 04:06, December 17, 2009 (UTC)

1hp Classic Punishment?
I'm inquiring about some information, because this wiki article is the only place to ever mention it. "It is possible to have a combat of 13 with 99 Summoning on an account with 1hp. (As a result of a RSC punishment method)" I've never heard of such punishment, can anyone give us some more details on it?

Was used when someone was caught macroing. All stats were redused to 1, including hp. 74.83.38.60 21:54, March 4, 2010 (UTC)


 * I think the statement should be deleted as Summoning isn't in RSC, therefore, it would not be possible at all. Also, I think that you would be banned instead of having your stats reduced. 03:14, May 12, 2010 (UTC)

Cleaned up a bit of Vandalism
Found this on the page: "In addition to the ability to shit on familiars," in front of the Summoning raising your combat level, part. I think this page might need to be flagged or semi-locked, as I've seen stuff like this before. 74.83.38.60 21:53, March 4, 2010 (UTC)

Headresses & helmets
I don't see headresses listed, and are these the only helmets that can be enchanted? --65.37.105.102 15:25, April 23, 2010 (UTC)

Death with a familier
Is it noted anywhere that if you die with a Beast of Burden holding items, you will lose these items? It seems pretty important. O.o

Empty scrolls from your Headdress?
I was wondering if that as possible? Can you take the summoning scrolls out of your headdress, or replace them with others, if you want to. Or do you need to use them all before you can put others in?

Thanks, 18:02, July 18, 2011 (UTC).

Nevermind, I discouvered it! I will update it into the article, I think it might help.

18:19, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

Highest summon gear bonuses?
Best summoning gear bonuses?

Obviously spirit cape for one... But I can't seem to find any articles on rswiki that provide this information. Would this article benefit from such an addition?

99.142.88.215 17:59, August 26, 2011 (UTC)

Charges
i was wondering how do i charge my helm? whenever i use my scrolls on my archer helm (e) it just says "This item cannot be used to charge headgear with scrolls." what does that mean? if someone could help could u tell me how i charge my helm? 19:03, November 6, 2011 (UTC)
 * You have to use attack scrolls from an attacking familiar. Example, scrolls from a bunyip won't work, but scrolls from a minotaur will. 19:25, November 6, 2011 (UTC)


 * so i cant store my multichop scrolls? thats crap. thanks for the information. 19:28, November 6, 2011 (UTC)


 * i've just discoverd that you can only have one charged headrest at a time (you can have several enchanted at a time).  I don't see this information in the headdress section.  would it be worth someone adding? 194.164.243.247 09:30, January 25, 2013 (UTC)