Talk:Money making guide

Please use money making methods you know that work, DO NOT put something that you presume makes good money as this is misleading information. --Whiplash 22:46, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Steel bars/GE guide
Just put up a guide of the method I'm using to make money at this point in time. Criticisms and comments? --Sol Levante 06:36, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

It may be better to go to Al Kharid, since it is the second or third shortest bank-to-furnace distance in Gielinor. Or in an alternative, if a member uses varrock teleport instead of walking, he should use the Port Phasmatys bank, which has the shortest distance. 06:55, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

I tried the Al Kharid way, but it can be too taxing on your supply of law runes unless you plan to smith more than 100 steel bars. Still, its an alternative that people can use if they wish. This guide was made with F2P in mind (since I'm F2P) and would probably have missed out on conveniences available in P2P. Perhaps someone with more knowledge of P2P matters edit the guide to suit P2P? Sol Levante 10:02, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
 * There's already something like this in the smithing section, so having this guide is pretty redundant and stands out a bit too much. I suggest you expand the part about steel bars in the smithing section to include this guide, because it does look pretty helpful. -- 13:31, 24 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Agreed, after taking a look at the smithing section it seems more suitable for the guide to be there. I've moved the guide and made a few edits to make it less visible compared to the other sections. http://runescape.wikia.com/wiki/Smithing#Steel_bars_and_the_Grand_Exchange

Sol Levante 14:55, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Inconsistent tone
This guide is very inconsistent. Some lines are written in commands (in the second person) and others in the third person. For instance:

''Buy adamantite ores, coal and nature runes. With a fire staff, superheat or smelt them into adamant bars and Talk to the Monks of Port Sarim to go to Entrana'' are both written in the second person command tone. However, lines such as A player can make money by buying rune bars for 10,000 to 13,000 coins each are written in the third person.''

Neither is more correct, nor better, than the other, but the article should be consistent. Socrates17 21:46, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * As this is titled Money Making Guide, 2nd person would be the better tense. I didn't catch this until you mentioned it. *Gives thumbs up*


 * So we've all agreed on second person then? [[Image:Bloodbarrage.png]]Butterman62[[Image:Icebarrage.png]] 01:09, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I say third-person because second-person seems to be more "do as I say", and third-person just seems more encyclopedic. 01:18, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Should we have a poll? [[Image:Bloodbarrage.png]]Butterman62[[Image:Icebarrage.png]] 01:31, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * No. Polls lets anyone vote, registered or not, and let people to vote more than once by just using another computer. 01:34, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * We just keep this discussion open to all editors then? [[Image:Bloodbarrage.png]]Butterman62[[Image:Icebarrage.png]] 01:35, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I say "yeah". 01:36, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree with the commanding tone. The guides seem more certain that way. Sol Levante 06:33, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
 * From what I'm familiar with, in second person writing, you talk directly to your reader using 'you' language and it's what's usually used in informational guides, which this is (but you already knew that!! ;) )


 * Third person writing uses 'he,' 'she,' 'it,' and 'they.' I think it's considered more formal than second person and is more often seen in things like reports or texts.


 * My suggestion is to make the tone second person...Dragon Lilly3 00:33, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Should be third person. It's more formal and encyclopedic, which is what we want the wiki to be. And the commanding tone sounds like it's ordering people around, which we don't want. Remember, these are suggestions, not instructions we have to follow. -- 02:50, 30 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I've fixed all the "you"'s I could find. We could remove the tag now...

Firzenr 12:34, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Is this correct?
Someone put this


 * Mine gold, silver, coal, and have an emerald. Cut your emerald and go to Meiyerditch. Find the man with a foot bone and he will ask for some money. Right-click on your ores and cut emerald and give them to the man. In return, you will recieve a note. DON'T READ THE NOTE! Go to the Varrock palace on the top floor and talk to the guard trainer. Give him the note and he will tell you to go to White Wolf mountain to find his 3 lost guards. When they are found, go back to the guard trainer and he will give you a certificate. Go back to Meiyerditch and give the odd man the certificate. He will then give you 500K. (This is repetitive)

is this correct? Butterman62 17:05, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
 * i severly doubt it is, someone probably put it up there just to make someone waste there time by running around attempting to do a ridiculous thing. i decided to check who it was added by, it was posted by this persons IP address 68.211.51.112. seeing his past contributions (one, he changed the examine text of tz-tok jad) i dont think he can be trusted so ill just take off that "hidden money tip". 20:32, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Hi, im peck u1. I really dont think the is true, but there also is a chance if not i suggest go members and try making bow strings and selling for 171gp ea! :P

Right now it says coal sells for 150,000 gold which is clearly off. 65.101.154.239 04:44, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Old Information, Abbreviations.
Well, I edited out the parts of merchanting tips that no longer work (You can't buy logs 1g each from gen store anymore). After that, I decided to edit it again and change all the K's to ,000s and the GP's to Golds...but when I tried to save it, someone had already edited it...and it was back to the way it was before, with old, false information. I'm not doing it again, but I will suggest that someone take out information that is false, which seems to be about half or more of the merchanting section, I think... Flash SP 04:13, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

That was my fault, i reverted it because Merchanting is still possible. My fault its back to the way you had it. Please sign your posts with four tildes., 03:12, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

adding money makers
Can anyone add their own money making strategy, according to the correct format? Craftsman317
 * Of course. =P

Ive got two to add, if I can just find out how the stars work..... Napster964 12:36, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
 * You can add { {difficulty|number}} to add the stars 02:04, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

delete plank make from magic money making section
the prices changed so dramatically that you wont be able to make money at all--j-g 09:48, 1 May 2008 (UTC)


 * actually based on today's ge market prices, 11 coins per plank can still be made, however i wouldn't think of this as a great way to make money, but it is a way to train magic affordably. Not the way i would choose to spend my time however...  18:39, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

splitting up sections
even though this has probably be discussed before.. how about seperating up the different skills, this would stop lag for slower computers, and allow you to find what section you want faster. Lakor 15:24, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

Ummm.... someone just destroyed one of my favorite pages in this wiki by splitting up the sections. This should be reverted, because it destroys the look of the whole page and makes accessing them really annoying. Also, it makes it much harder to compare all of the moneymaking methods with each other.24.0.93.52 23:47, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
 * That was done because editing the page when all the information was gathered on one article was much more difficult, as the page took a very long time to load/save. -- Andorin Kato  This    That  02:09, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
 * How about maybe not splitting up the different skills, but splitting up into member and none member methods? This would at least allow you to compare different methods while also changing the size of the page so it is easier to load? Lakor 08:44, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Then those two subpages, particularly the members' page, would take a long time to load. -- 18:51, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

Money Through Steel Bars.
This guide lists smithing steel bars as less effective than smithing mithril bars. How come? The profit per bar may be slightly more, but mithril smithing requires more trips as it requires 4 coal as opposed to 2.24.0.93.52 23:48, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Split
Due to this page taking an eternity to load after making an edit, I've created various subpages, one for each of the skills and one for merchanting, to store existing ideas and add new ones. -- Andorin Kato  This    That  05:01, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

All ways possible? Or just smart things that make sense
I am referring directly to the silk merchanting thing. It is utterly ridiculous as a method, even for a newb straight off Tutorial Island. Much smarter for that player would be to collect eggs across from the cows, I do not recall the name of the farm. But they spawn quickly enough, and they sell for about 100 gp each right now. Much better than that silk nonsense. So I think that silk should be removed, because while it is possible, it is no way at all whatsoever advisable.--Degenret01 10:26, 2 June 2008 (UTC)


 * One thing about this method of earning money (the silk trade) is that it doesn't rely upon the fickle prices on the Grand Exchange. It is one of the oldest ways to earn money on Runescape, even when other methods of earning money for new players simply didn't work.


 * Back before the Grand Exchange, this was one of the "safe" ways to earn money as well. It still requires only interaction with NPCs and is a guaranteed way to make money.  Yes, I would agree that there are other methods of earning money for brand new players that take into account the current economic situation of the game, and the Grand Exchange has made life so much easier for brand new players.  Gathering food resources (Eggs, Buckets of milk, Potatoes, Cheese, Grain, etc.) are activities that don't require special skills but can earn a whole bunch of money due to players trying to level up on Cooking and food prices on the whole going up.


 * Even so, I think the silk merchanting is legitimate in terms of being a one star activity and is something which Jagex doesn't seem willing to screw up too awfully with future updates, as they've kept this method of earning money in the game since Runescape Classic. --Robert Horning 12:47, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

Money Starting Tips
I don't know what the opinion of other is for this section, but I feel it ought to be oriented toward assuming that you are fresh off of Tutorial Island and are skill level 1 in every single skill.

A recent edit suggested that food collecting (IMHO a good early money source for new players) could be enhanced simply by cooking the food yourself. While good in itself, I reverted the edit due to the fact that such food preparation requires at least a moderately high (for new players) cooking level and can't be assumed for players reading this section for hints. I'm not going to engage in an edit war over this issue, but I'm trying to explain here on the talk page why I've made this edit.

BTW, I can think of a few ideas for earning money by using Cooking skills, so perhaps I ought to add that as a new section. That does require some creative digging into the prices, as doing things like cooking fish generally are at a huge loss. --Robert Horning 06:01, 8 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't believe there are any decent ways of making money as a new player. I used to suggest running airs but that is no longer viable. [[Image:OldAgility.gif]] Blazel 06:03, 8 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Clay. They sell for coins each and can be mined at level 1 Mining. -- 06:30, 8 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Air running still isn't too bad. But you have to complete Rune Mysteries first, and you have to find a player willing to assist at least 6x or better.  The air alter typically has somebody doing 7x or even 8x assisting, where you bring your own rune essence and come back with 8x air runes.  Air runes certainly sell very well on the Grand Exchange, and it is one way to earn far more than the typical price for rune essence on the Grand Exchange.  15 x 8 = 120 coins per essence, with rune essence at about 40 each on the Grand Exchange can give a modest profit even if you don't mine the stuff.  I wouldn't call that "no longer viable", but it is different than it was before.  That is still about 2200 coins profit per trip to the alter and back... a bit lower than was typical with the old air running, but not bad.  You can easily do about 8-10 trips per hour.
 * BTW, have you (Blazel) ever tried to sell food items on the Grand Exchange? Earning between 10k-20k per hour isn't all that hard at all, with no starting cash.  Sure, you aren't going to get a full set of dragon at that earning rate... but you don't need it either.  A couple of hours worth of "work" on and off again (it doesn't even have to be continuous) can earn a full set of rune armor.
 * There are also some "merchanting" methods that I've uncovered that require no skills in terms of in-game stats, but can "earn" about 1m or more per day and only about a half hour of "work" in terms of mouse clicks. There are so many ways to earn money as a beginning player (even F2P) that I can't believe an attitude like the one above!
 * This said, I will admit to having higher stats allowing you to earn much more and faster. I've finally been able to get my "main" over the hump in terms of casual training for most skills that I'm generally earning more money than I'm dumping into the skills.  And the skills seem to feed on each other enhancing all of them to one degree or another.  But the point I'm trying to make is that earning the initial "stake" in terms of having some cash as a new player to get some decent equipment or investing in money earning activities isn't all that hard.  --Robert Horning 17:07, 8 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Personally I think that the game splits quite neatly into two areas. There's the 'pre-rune' phase when you need money to the order ~50K. Then as soon as you've bought full rune and a dragon weap at about 100K, the price for weapons and armour shoots up. Suddenly it costs about 10-20M for a single item, far out of the reach of a casual player. So sure, there is a million methods to earn ~10-20K per hour. But to make the real money (Ms).... thats hard and restricted mostly to Double-Nature Runecrafting. King Runite1 17:36, 8 June 2008 (UTC)


 * While I agree that there are multiple tiers of money earning potential, and that earning money as a member vs. as a F2P account is a definite advantage, as is earning money at higher levels vs. at lower levels, I strongly disagree with you sentiment that double-nat crafting is the only real method of making large quantities of money. On the contrary, I've heard several opinions from long-time members that have suggested many different methods, and that is in fact why this guide is prepared.  Of course I've found that economic education for most people is rather lacking, and it is a strong understanding of economics that can help you to maximize your profit earning potential in this game.  --Robert Horning 18:52, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Proofred Page
i have proofred the page and changed it all into 3rd person view.... ~Derf321~
 * Erm... no, you haven't. -- 04:04, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Arbitrary Comparisons
The five-star comparison being used right now is incredibly inconsistent. Shark fishing and cutting magic logs, for instance, are listed as being just about as good as double nature runes when double natures can generate as much as six times the income in the same time period as the other two. In fact, collecting swamp tar is a better money maker than shark fishing or magic logs if the correct source is used. If anyone has the skill levels to test these methods, a GP-per-Hour comparison would be far more effective. --Ashura652 18:03, 14 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Agreed, it's also listed that growing snapdragons or ranarr seeds is equivalent to marigold growing. Clearly snapdragons are a more effective way to make money. --Chewy 21:32, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Hunter skill moneymake
As many of you know there is ability to make very big profit on Hunter skill. Actually there isn't any article about it. I don't have much expirance in making money on Hunter ,so it would be nice if someone make da article...

--79.186.185.223 13:35, 17 June 2008 (UTC)dawidkiller3--79.186.185.223 13:35, 17 June 2008 (UTC)\

Unreliability/inconsistency
Someone else has already mentioned this, but the five-star system used now is completely unreliable, due to the fact that this wiki is made by several people who each have their ownviews on whether 50kan hour is 2 or 3 stars ect. We could use a GP-per-hour system as listed above, but an even better system in my opinion (not even really a system) is simply putting a note next to the star rating info about how much money-per-hour a method of that rating generates. I do not think that wuld be too hard.

-Peanutman728 (I cant log in for some reason)

Well, seeing as it took a month and a half for anyone to even acknowledge my previous statement, it seems like we might need a better way of calling attention to the problem, as by this point the whole guide is sort of a joke, just like just about every other money making guide out there.

--Ashura652 06:05, 24 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Try using the Yew Grove.  11:21, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Another idea is to order it from most GP/hr to least. Then we could completely eliminate the "5 star system," and use something a lot more reliable, and a lot less biased and does not rely on opinion. Sctjkc01 18:25, 7 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The only major drawback to a Gp/hr method is that for some players at a given skill level and resources, some methods of earning money may be harder than others. The point here is that something much more objective into calculating the various stars ought to be done.... which IMHO would include the rate of money earning, the level and number of skills involved in creating the item, and quests that must be completed prior to gathering/making that item.  All of these things can impact the "difficulty" of a particular approach... although I'd admit that gp/hr ought to be a major consideration and for the purposes of this guide may be the only real consideration most people will use in terms of using this guide.


 * The major question that begs to be asked: How can you objectively calculate what the gp/hr rate of any given method might be?  It isn't nearly as easy as you might suggest, and some players are naturally more efficient than others for even the same general kind of task... not to mention that some even seemingly unrelated skills like agility or your combat level (even for resource gathering) can have a huge impact on how quickly you can perform a task.  --Robert Horning 12:08, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Prerequisites should not affect the "difficulty" of the moneymaking level, and here's why: when you do a quest, it stays done forever. When you get a skill level, it's not going to ever go down and force you to train it back up to that level again. So that means if you want to craft double nats, you don't need to get 91 runecrafting for every hour you spend crafting. You get the level once, you can always do it forever on that character. In other words, the moneymaking activity itself is separate from the prerequisites.


 * As far as your major question, it certainly is one that needs to be answered. Here's how I would answer it: I think it would be best simply to cite the source for the data. Probably a lot of it is going to come from independent research, so whoever's doing the research ought to simply describe their method of testing, say what their results were, calculate the profit they got, and then post all that maybe on their user page or something and cite it as a source on the page. For example, I might write something like this for a test I did:


 * Chopping magic logs in Isafdar
 * With 99 woodcutting, a dragon axe, and using rings of dueling and elf teleport crystals to bank, I was able to obtain an average of about 120 magic logs per hour in four 45-minute tests. At the current prices, that comes to about 150k gp/hr and also about 30k woodcutting xp/hr.


 * I'm a firm believer that any good guide for this game ought to be supported by hard data, or else anyone can just claim anything, and that could especially be a problem here where anybody can edit the page. What if somebody says you can make 300k gp/hr chopping magic logs and nobody is there to contradict them? (Besides me, I mean.) It would just be a made-up number, a guess. Now, you could fudge or fabricate a report like the one I've shown here, but the format of it makes it a breeze for anyone to duplicate the experiment and confirm or deny its accuracy, and it allows people to follow the citation to the source and get more information about the method.


 * Or of course, the same kind of section could be added directly to the moneymaking guide, but it would make the page look very different and it would be a very big project, big enough that it should probably go in the Yew Grove instead of just the talk page here. Not sure if that's really a good idea though.


 * Personally, I think if we can't make our moneymaking guide the best guide it can be, we shouldn't have a moneymaking guide at all. troacctid 22:51, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * You have to start somewhere, which is why raising this issue is something useful. One of the problems we are facing here is that "original research" is going to be necessary to document these sort of money making schemes.  This would include explaining all of the variables that can go into any sort of training method, including skill levels required, what skills can "improve" over time (for example, mining more ore faster due to higher mining levels), quests that can help the resource gathering (such as the various transport systems unlocked with quests)... with emphasis on the particular transports useful for the specific money making opportunity, and with pieces of equipment that may help improve the resource gathering as well.  Mining coal with a bronze pickaxe isn't going to be as useful as a rune pickaxe, for example.


 * With all of these variables, it can be tough to advise somebody new to the game (presumably why this guide is being written) about money earning potentials when there are a whole bunch of things that are assumed. Certainly more veteran players would be using rune pickaxes/dragon axes for resource gathering, but those are only the most obvious examples.


 * The next question that begs to be asked: How can we organize this "hard data" where various players could help in confirming or at least noting what their experience has been in earning money using a particular method?  How do we also keep the rating system from being skewed for only the high level members who obviously have so many more advantages over newer players that it isn't really a fair comparison?  --Robert Horning 13:19, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


 * How about separating a whole section for moneymaking methods that can be done with little to no prerequisites? Examples would be making planks at the sawmill, tanning hides, buying various items from stores and reselling to players, mining pure essence, and collecting items like white berries from spawns. Or, just state the requirements for the activity in its entry in the guide, and players browsing through can look for things they can already do. troacctid 17:23, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

This is being discussed on Yew Grove

Selling ash heaps & bones in the GE
I've noticed that nobody has put down the semi-effectiveness of selling ash and bones in the GE. It's gold per set of bones, and  gold for each heap of ashes, using the "GEPrice" tag for each of the prices. Would this be a good item to put on the list? Bones would be easily enough collected (seeing as each killable NPC would drop one), and so will the ash (people would try training Firemaking after purchasing logs from the GE right in the desk area). Sctjkc01 18:07, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Ashes definitely not, 5-6 gp each is far too little. Bones, maybe. Best things to kill for bones are probably Men in Edgeville (especially in p2p where they drop herbs and lv1 clues) or cows in the Gnomecopter field. But, before listing this, you should test it and confirm it is indeed good money. If it turns out to be only 50k gp/hr, don't bother. troacctid 18:13, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * It could be where the player stockpiles bones in their bank over a period of time, and sell them all in one shot in the GE getting a large amount of money. This is actually a thing I have done myself, and I have gotten around 20k in about 20 minutes selling junk from my bank, including bones and other things i didn't need.Sctjkc01 18:28, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

Snape Grass Method
This is my first day to be a member and fellow editor of Runescape Wiki. I have just finished creating the Snape Grass money making method on the page. I have looked at it carefully and added a few links here and there, but I'm sure it does not sound very good. It would be very appreciated if someone could go on in and fix it up. It is a good and effective way to make money. That's what i did as a non-member. I turned out pretty good. :D Thps3m8 03:59, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

I see some people have made some changed. Thank you. I have just added the members tips under the Snape grass section mentioning the agility shortcut and beast's of burden from summoning. If there is anything to fix, please do. Thps3m8 20:01, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

Wheres Herblore?
I was looking over this page seeing the usual oddities (coal and clay mining in their own section, not under mining, ranged minigame not under ranging etc.) when i noticed that there isnt a herblore section! There are numerous ways to make money with herblore (at 34 making unf...er... well i forget but whatever you can make at 34, upgrading sara brews, etc.) I don't want to sound like a jerk, but i don't plan on making a herblore page, do to my inherent laziness, but if someone else would, i would be most pleased. (And i would contribute) Swordfishguy 20:02, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

Too big
I was wondering if we can merge some money making guide into the proper skills.When I was editing, it stated that the KB is much bigger than the standard 32kb(I think it said 32.)Powers38 01:07, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

Combat guide
What is up with that combat guide?! It was a good decent long guide last time I was here now it is just 1-3 suggestions on making money. Tsuk4s4 03:25, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

What wise guy
What wise guy replaced all the current price showers with links and estimates. those where there for a reason. there isn't a single one left.-- 18:44, 29 November 2008 (UTC)


 * I just added a section but I didn't change any of the others, maybe it made a conflict :S this seems to have happened before I made the edit though --SuperLlama 18:47, 29 November 2008 (UTC)


 * I saw the edits you made and you aren't the cause. It happened over time with people not knowing what the "GEPrice" tags where, so they changed them to estamates and links. I've made some of the corrections, but it will take awhile to fix them all unless lots of people help.-- 19:08, 29 November 2008 (UTC)


 * I can't get the GEPrice tag to work for Pastry Dough; so I just used an estimate for mine. I might have just put in the wrong code though; it gave this: --SuperLlama 20:14, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Fixed for you 20:22, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * ah, so I just capitalized it wrong. Thanks :) --SuperLlama 20:23, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm helping now, adding GEPrice tags instead of the stupid Runescape query links that don't work :P --SuperLlama 20:27, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * thanks. While you are working over long term you should have an under construction marker up so that we don't get an editor war starting.-- 20:59, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
 * no problem. I got all the [1]'s and [2]'s and stuff replaced, so its pretty much fixed now :) (lol at all the indents XD) --SuperLlama 21:15, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

prove it
it was said on RuneScape:Requested featured articles/Money making guidethat many of the options in this guide are "worthless". Many of these methods waver depending on how the market is and their guides show that VIA the GEPrice tags used in the coding and it is warned on the top of the page. If you know better ones: offer them up and if you see things that would make the page better: do them and see if they get undone or changed all the more. don't forget that this page is up for January -- 03:25, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
 * well i'm waiting. I haven't seen the guide edited recently and there are no additions to the nominations other then the wise old man who was re-added.-- 06:51, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Khalron, why you not reacting or responding, i ain't seen a thing out of you since you made that post.-- 13:16, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

My reasons for opposing are pretty much all covered under the Inconsistencies section of this page, so I'm not going to list them all. I believe the AOTM should feature the best articles from the Wiki; pleasing to look at, perhaps some varied grapholoy, and above all, factually accurate. This page is none of those three. For example, collecting Monk's Robes is rated as 3 star. Not only would it be poor money, but it offers no experience whatsoever, and by the time a player has 31 prayer, I'd imagine they would have learnt some far better money making methods. Silk-merchanting; are you kidding me? You can make such tiny amounts of money from this it doesn't even come close to being worthwhile, simply killing cows in the Gnomecoptor field would be a far better use of a beginners time, and would yield experience too. In the members' section, there is a part about raising cats for death runes, which would again be deathly (excuse the pun) slow for making money. I know a fair bit about making money, and this article is far too erratic and inconsistent to be allowed anywhere near being featured. Khalron 23:51, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Consistency
Would it be possible to come up with a somewhat more consistent method of rating the various money-making methods? The star system is a great start, but what are the bases for giving certain methods a higher rating than others? Are we shooting for more coins/hour = higher rating? Do the required levels for that method come into play at all? Should we list the coins/hour in the method explanations? Without a standard format, these methods and therefore this entire page are far too disorderly. And what's up with putting various m-m methods in the page itself? Why can they not be placed under a miscellaneous page at the very least? Bf2142pwner 14:25, 16 December 2008 (UTC), at your service.
 * This is crazy; I just did a quick check over the main article and found that many of the m-m methods listed at the beginning of the page are repeated in various skill-related m-m methods farther down. Would it be possible to simply delete whole sections of this page?  It would cause the page to become far more wieldy (as opposed to unwieldy, so to speak) and a better candidate for article of the month, in my opinion.
 * I think we should replace the ratings with how many coins/hour you get, to make it more consistent. immibis 06:23, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Beginner Skills
Originally, when this page was re-factored to push most of the money making ideas into sub-pages, there were just a couple of items that were left on this main page which were so general in nature that they could apply to all players.

I think it is time to create some more sub-pages again... this time pushing all of the remaining ideas onto sub-pages.

Many of them are really good ideas, but do require certain quests to be performed or certainly require some meele skill levels that are unrealistic for beginning players. I am suggesting that money-making skills that can be done by beginning players be organized as just that: Some methods for new players just starting out in the game or money making methods that don't have any special requirements of any kind and aren't "dangerous".

I'm advocating the creation of five new sub-pages:


 * Ideas for new F2P players
 * Ideas for new members
 * Questing money makers (money making ideas for players doing quests)
 * Money makers requiring combat for F2P
 * Money makers requiring combat for members

About the only F2P idea I can think of requiring a F2P quest is mining on Crandor Isle... or at the very least there isn't that many ideas that require quests to be completed that can be done by F2P players. There still may be a need for a polyglot page called "Miscellaneous" for ideas that don't fit neatly into any category, but we don't need to expand this main page any more.

Are there any other ideas on how this content can be organized, and is there agreement that this reorganization should happen? --Robert Horning 10:24, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

member guides?
1. some of the p2p guides are f2p as well and 2. can we have someone move it to a seperate page? some admin?15:14, 22 December 2008 (UTC)


 * You don't need special administrator privileges for moving content or even moving pages. If you see a need here, please help us out.  Put in the links for the new pages and help make this a better wiki.  If you are unsure about how to get this to happen, however, I'd be more than willing to give you some pointers to get it to work.  It never hurts to ask.  --Robert Horning 17:40, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

adding rune images to the RCing guide
I was thinking of adding a column after the level requirements in the RCing money making guide with images to show which runes were being crafted with that method and also to add a little color to it so they are not so "boring". Any objections? If I didn't think it looked ok after trying it, I would abort it. I'll check back after Christmas. 06:27, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

GP per hour, and use the 5-star rating for patience needed to get to that income level
It would make much, much, much more sense to list how many gp per hour you can do at the minimum level for a task, and sort all money making methods accordingly. The stars should keep track of how much training/patience/quests you have to go thru before you can start using the method.

This way silk buying from NPC would rank waaaaaay at the end, and not be mistaken for equivalent or better to, say, mining clay with clay bracers and selling soft clay which is level 1.

Also there should be a section on "dailies".


 * This is in fact a terrific idea! Delapaco 19:16, 2 March 2009 (UTC)


 * I believe this idea has been worked through on the yew grove

Nomination?
I think this page has already been passed over; I'll remove the tag. Besides, I don't think the spelling, grammatical, and factual errors make it a good candidate for the main page...Shinray1kuo 03:15, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

About F2P "Air Rune Running"
I dont belive this is the correct way to run. It may be a: 1. Mistake, 2. Noob edit, or 3. another way. I dunno.. Kid2255  Talk    19:51, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Major cleanup of this page
In a sort of feature creep that has been happening here, a whole bunch of "money making tips" have been added to this page that have been thrown on in a very haphazard fashion and have made this page illegible. A couple of good "starter" tips that were left after breaking most of the original money making tips into sub-pages have turned into dozens of tips... many of which are duplicated in the sub-pages.

Unless there is an objection here, I'm going to wipe them out and/or throw them onto sub-pages as I outlined above to set up some "beginner" money making tips and do some other clean-up on these pages. Please, I'm interested in a discussion here, and if there is a legitimate objection, I'd love to hear it. I'm throwing down the gauntlet and demanding that some higher standards on some of these ideas be brought forward. --Robert Horning 23:26, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
 * That would be perfectly sofa-factory to me. :) WWTDD? 23:43, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Cleanup
I think we need a new order for the Money Making Guides. I propose 3 actions: What do you think about this topic? -- Rrgogoman 12:27, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) Since the single guides contain member and non member content i think the seperation in member and non member guides is no longer consistent. (1) We should only seperate in guides with skills and guides without skills. (2) Therefore the seperated guides (for example misc.) should be merged.
 * 2) The headline structure was ok when there were still tables with tips on this page. It seams overfull now. (3) We should replace it with simple lists and should not repeat the introduction.
 * Free and member's moneymaking methods are judged by different standards, so it makes sense to have them apart for each other. Some methods would be strong moneymakers in f2p, but terrible in p2p, such as cutting yews. Of course, the guide as is doesn't separate them very well, and doing so would require some re-writing, so I can get behind your idea anyway. Also, when separating guides with skills from guides without skills (which is a good idea), it would be important to make a decision on where to put guides without skills but with a significant skill requirement--making unfinished potions, for example, which requires an herblore level but isn't actually training the herblore skill. That's my thoughts on the matter. --troacctid 20:49, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Perhaps we could change the color of the star rating system. So we take the blue bar for the F2P Money making guides and we add a red star rating for the member guides. Therefore a user can see very fast if it is a F2P or a P2P guide and how good the guide is.
 * The matter of perfectly rating a money making guide is very complex. Its very subjective and in my opinion it would be the best extimate to give ranges of money per hour. For that we could collect Data samples (like the GE-history in the Grand Exchange Market Watch).
 * I think the skill requirement information is already present. Its the first column in every table. The seperation in making money and train and making money is in my opinion not nedded, because it's a money making guide not a training guide. Skilling is a nice second effect. ;) Therefore is - in my opinion - the seperation in another group not needed. -- Rrgogoman 07:33, 3 March 2009 (UTC)


 * While we are at it I suggest formulating a guideline for how to give ranking to the different methods, ie the stars. One way is to simply state earning requirements per hour for different levels, another to norm the comparisment to one particular method, for example three stars for spinning flax. I think a brief introduction what the stars mean is also needed. Delapaco 22:42, 1 March 2009 (UTC)
 * To norm this method seams very complex. I think the definition of ranges by collected estimated money/hour is a flexible and practical method. The comparisment to other methods seams to me too subjective. If you f.e. think that killing green dragons is three times better than spinning flax and you further think that making unfinished potions is 2 times better than spinning flax, but making unfinished potions is 2 times better than killing green dragon. This example is inconsistent and not absolute, because there is no best method. -- Rrgogoman 07:33, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Sounds like good logic to me. My main issue with the star system today is that it hardly means anything, and I also doubt that either readers nor writers know what it stands for. I have for example seen talk additions like "I think this method is worth at least three stars because I make a lot of money from it". Well plucking potatoes will eventually also make you a santa hat, even if it will take a while. We should define a scale that is easy to understand. And then if we are later on required to revise it, then so be it. * Earnings per hour, is easy to interpret, hard to misunderstand. What might really be needed though is some general information on how to calculate this number/what to expect from it. If you spin flax for example - then banking time should be included, not just the time by the wheel. However ge buy time is not interesting as you can buy any amount of flax at the same time. Delapaco 19:56, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Cleanup?
I want everyone to know that I'm basically single-handedly going through this guide on a rampage of restoration. Suggestions and such, either made here or on my talk page, are very welcome. -- 18:31, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Style
While I'm rampaging through these pages fixing them up, I may as well add something about writing style. Read RuneScape:Quest style guide. The page says that it is acceptable to write quest guide pages in second-form and/or command form (so long as the writing is still half-decent, of course). While the policy page applies specifically to quest guides, my interpretation is that it applies to any guide page on the wiki. This means it is better to write "Talk to Ned in Draynor Village" than "The player must talk to Ned in Draynor Village." In an article about rune two-handers you don't want to say "You need 40 Attack to wield it," because you want to be informative without speaking to anyone. "The player needs 40 Attack to wield it" is a better way to write it, but "40 Attack is needed to wield it" is probably the best you can get. A guide page is different because you are giving instructions on how to achieve a specific goal- on the Dragon Slayer page the instructions are how to finish the quest. Well, here, the instructions are how to make money. As such I believe that second person and/or command form is not only okay here, but much preferred to using "the player" because "the player" is not good writing. -- 18:46, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Money Making Metric
Based on some assumptions from this disscusion - i made a system to measure a money making method. It is based on some variables: On that basis we can calculate the minimum and maximum profit for that method in a practical and compareable way. So you can do this method a timespan long including the banking time and just count how much you produced - tata you got the profit per hour. The other values could be retrieved from the Grand Exchange Market Watch. Therefore we could include the range of the money making method in a new colum of the guide listing. We only need a page specifing the variables of this method. For example:
 * 1) the minimum and maximum cost of a unit made.
 * 2) the minimum and maximum value of the unit sold.
 * 3) the minimum and maximum count of units produced in a specific time interval.

The profit range for my spinning flax example is:

See User:Rrgogoman/FlaxSpinning for the data and Template:MoneyMethod for the template.

What do you think about it? -- 09:26, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Question / additional money making tips
I had found a few tips and tricks that work well and i am wondering if i can make my own page here with my own tips?? Then i was wondering if i can add a link to this page << the actual artical I have quite a few tricks so i was wondering if i can ... add my own page? Thanks Coaster4321 19:12, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
 * There are many subpages to the money making guide. You can add them to the appropriate subpage, as I believe we have nearly all categories covered. 19:14, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

Hmm if that is so can i make or add on to it then. I would like to add my page i made.. Its on my userpage right now so its not on here officially yet. coaster3000@gmail.com 20:32, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Well I looked at some of your tips on your page. Some were covered already, and the rest can go to subpages, such as Money making guide/Mining for one. We don't allow users to link their userpages into mainspace though, so you would have to merge the information that isn't duplicate into the corresponding articles. 20:36, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

Want to make new topic in the page
I made something and i think there should be a miscellaneous section in there. So i can add my money calculator to it << that calculator is on my userpage though. and... its a download << its a spread sheet on microsoft exel 2003 OR above So Please mod or what ever please approve of this in my post here coaster4321 21:14, 3 April 2009 (UTC) << i am getting new sig Sorry lol Ok i just saw the post just above this. so i am not allowed to link to userpage hmmm. well can someone tell me how to add my page then to a regular without it being moved back from something like its not allowed here or whatnot. thanks the page is User:Coaster4321/Money_Making_Calc Thanks coaster4321 21:17, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

Just undid something << a vandel << DOUBLE VANDEL actually
So just look at the page edited by me and compare with a few i guess im not sure but i know i just undid a double vandal. They vandalized 2 times in a row << thinking it was already not vandalized and it was ruined 2 times in a row without revert coaster4321 22:07, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

Addition to cooking subpage
Nobody mentioned making pineapple pizzas? I still can't figure out how to add it into the table of methods, maybe someone can help me on this. The method: purchase plain pizza (cooked), pineapples. Use knife on pineapples to make rings (the g/e limit on pineapple rings is 100/4 hour). Then use those rings on the pizza.

MAJOR FIX OF STARS SYSTEM IN AROUND A WEEK (17th may 2009)
The stars system is clearly flawed and inconsistent, many people have pointed this out and there has been a discussion on the yew grove here. We have reached the conclusion that the following earning potential to stars ratio is appropriate:

And one week from now I intend to start reworking this page by changing the stars of each method after spending some time attempting it. Beside the amount of stars should be the actual gp/hour I managed to achieve. In short I could use alot of help doing this, specifcally I am f2p so can't rate the p2p methods. If you want to help or make a comment on the subject, go to the page linked to above. Thanks --Serenity1137 20:01, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Protecting this page (the main page, not this talk page)
For some reason, this page seems to be turning into a favorite spot for brain-dead vandals. Is there some way to protect that page, such that only people who have created accounts and are logged in can change it?

Cscooper 18:21, 31 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Looking at the history, it seems a high proportion of edits are vandalism of some sort, or undoing/rollbacking vandalism. And it has been (temporarily) protected before. I'll permanently semiprotect it now; anyone who disagrees feel free to voice concerns here, I'll (or any admin will) unprotect it/change to a temporary protect if wished. 21:26, 31 May 2009 (UTC)

Money making
What is the best way for me to make money?

(With the following stats)

combat level: 63 attack:53 Str:52 Defense:52 range:2 prayer:23 Magic:43 runecrafting:23 construction:48 HP:51 agility:34 herblore:20 thieving:30 crafting:46 fletching:16 slayer:19 hunter:15 mining:59 Smithing:50 Fishing:49 Cooking:49 firemaking:33 woodcutting:53 farming:25 summoning:5 money:about 30k